My main interest in virtual worlds remains the way in which they serve as an accidental laboratory for studying historical change in societies over time, and in particular, the evolution of emergent, accidental or unpredictable structures and practices.
So there's this thing called "The Burning Crusade" that I've heard about. Maybe you have too? Let's make this an open thread of sorts for collecting and commenting on reports of transformation or novelty in the social structures within World of Warcraft. I have a few initial thoughts below the fold.
1. As always, anybody who has been in a beta test (or just is a perceptive guesser) could make an economic killing if they prepared properly. For example, for the first five days or so of the expansion going live, anybody who stockpiled runecloth and brought a character within nothing but stacks of runecloth in his bags to Falcon Watch or the Temple of Tehlamut could probably sell those stacks directly to characters trying to skill up their first aid at the trainer for premium prices of five or six times the pre-expansion norms on the Auction House.
2. There are also new markets. A few of the extremely powerful bind-on-equip green items I've gotten can be equipped by level 57 characters. I would think that these would now command premium prices on the Auction House once things settle down in a bit as they will allow a level 57 character to dominate the pre-Outland quests and so on that they must complete. Any portal mage could probably open portals 24/7 to the capital cities back in Azeroth and make huge amounts of money.
3. This connects to one of the most crucial changes. All of the pre-existing content of the game for levels 1-57 remains important, as of course does the new content of the starting areas. There will be substantial cohorts of Blood Elves and Draenei (the race whose spelling may be the most non-intuitive word ever to be typed into chat boxes frequently: it's the new "rouge", without a doubt) who will still need and experience this content. But unless I'm missing something, all of the level 58-60 content laboriously created by Blizzard for the original game has become instantly irrelevant. I don't think there will be anyone in Molten Core, Blackwing Lair, UBRS and so on, unless it's massively geared-up level 68+ characters doing it for shits and giggles in bizarre combinations, much the way that players have been experimenting with killing Onyxia with the smallest possible number of uber-geared characters. If you had to be level 60 to get to Outland, then I think the existing endgame instances would still have some play in them, at least the 5 and 10-person ones. But with level 58+ eligible to go, those are now pretty much going to be empty until a huge mob of Blood Elves and Draenei are doing them at level 56-57.
4) This isn't just because Outland is new, it's also because the paradigm for playing in Outland (so far) strikes me as an unvoiced confession of the design mistakes made in instances like Scholomance and Lower Blackrock Spire. I may change my tune later on, but Hellfire Citadel as an instance is fun, intense and short, plus players who really do want to have a lengthy, unpleasant experience playing an instance will have the opportunity to customize the difficulty level of the instance.
5) So far the only really new practice I've seen isn't exactly new, but with the intensity of players pouring into Outland in a single wave, tagging mobs for quest credit is once again a competitive art form that has spawned an interesting moral discourse in its wake about what's fair and unfair. That's already ebbing a bit as the next wave of quests starts to disperse players at the leading edge of the mass population of levellers.
So, TN readers: your own observations and discoveries so far?
I've noticed on a couple of the servers that I frequent, that a lot of the trade-goods have doubled or tripled in price in Ironforge. Most types of Bars (copper, tin, bronze) etc, are selling for 2+ gold per stack where a week ago they were more like 50-60 silver. I don't pay much attention to runecloth though, so don't know how it has changed.
Posted by: Brandon Checketts | Jan 18, 2007 at 13:39
More people are leveling production professions instead of gathering, now that there are some really really nice Bind-on-Pickup items that those professions can make. Plus with most people checking out Outland, there are few people harvesting the lower types of gathering materials. So there's a shortage, plus an increase in demand.
Posted by: Verilazic | Jan 18, 2007 at 14:00
I'm less inclined to believe that AQ40/Naxx gear is completely ruled out. As a 63 shaman, I've yet to replace a single BWL+ piece of gear I've recieved. And only replaced 3 pieces of gear total, a green trinket -> a blue quest reward, my ZG chest pieces and my WSG leggings. However, I'm perhaps far from the norm, but I do believe that the early raid instances will force us to come back and gear up in Naxx/AQ40 before being able to proceed. Instance attunements are also insanely difficult. http://worldofraids.free.fr/bc/diagramm.jpg is a fine example of gaining entrance into the Caverns of Time.
-My 2 Cents
-Jess / GTez
Posted by: Jesse | Jan 18, 2007 at 14:09
You may be right about AQ40/Naxx, maybe even BWL, but UBRS and ZG are, I'm thinking, pretty much toast.
Posted by: Timothy Burke | Jan 18, 2007 at 15:14
Personally I have been upset by the way the expansion completely negates all previous player achievements over the last 2 years. Even the best tier 3 gear is worthless at level 65, legendary weapons have worse dps than level 68 greens, skills which required many raid runs can be bought at a trainer for pennies and recipes which took 50+ runs of a dungeon to obtain can be bought from a vendor for a few gold. Not even the rested bonus of level 60 characters has been preserved. A guy who hit 58 yesterday is just as well off in TBC as I am, having been at level 60 and raiding for two years now. This is extremely upsetting and demoralising, as it makes players feel like their accomplishments in the game to date have been worthless.
Posted by: RedWolf | Jan 18, 2007 at 15:18
@RedWolf
If what you are saying is completely valid, then Blizzard wants to make the game even more addicting in a way. Since if the new gear from the expansion was about the same as from the original game, then it wouldn't matter who got the new gear and hence there would be no good reason to buy the expansion (unless you're really into the blood elves which are daytime night elves or the dranei which are sci fi aliens). By making the new gear wholly exceed the previous content, hooked users will want to and will most likely buy the expansion, which would bring revenue. Blizzard is greedy. The days of StarCraft and Battle.net are over.
Posted by: Snow | Jan 18, 2007 at 15:46
I think what has happened to me personally is that I lost some points of reference. Matters of course have suddenly disappeared and the virtual everyday life is totally confused. As you all mentioned before, prices of runeclothe or items have changed dramatically because some green boe's are much better than rare or even some old fashioned epic stuff. I don't know how a fight with a level 64 ice mage will end up because I never met one of this species before! Is this big sword of the tauren only a big sword or is it close to imbaness? What does this funny golden light coming out of the paladin's dingbat do to me? Which place do I have to take in a world that has been shaken? I still do understand the basic mechanics of what surrounds me, but I have a increasing lack of knowledge of what lies in front of me. In fewer words: I'm a noob again. And I don't know if this feeling is refreshing or daunting.
Posted by: Tim | Jan 18, 2007 at 16:15
A number of items lost considerable value in the run-up to the expansion release, such as (but hardly limited to) arcane crystals, which had been something of a gold farmer standby. I do not see on my server (Frostwolf - PvP, large population) a change in arcane crystal value. Their value remains depressed.
I suppose we might have expected this, as players who depend on mining for money (or for the creation of epic armor and weapons) expected they'd have access to newer, better ores and gems in the expansion.
Some epic, level-60 crafted items are equal in quality or are inferior to level 63-64 greens and blues.
This depression of value is not observed for all things. Some items, like level 50-60 BOE greens, have neither lost nor gained value on our (Alliance) AH.
An excellent point made in another reply is that some lower level mats are actually gaining value, apparently because they are being used to speed-level professions to 325 or so. So while arcane crystals might fall in value, items like runecloth, dreamfoil, and rugged leather will retain or gain value in the short-term. And indeed, I am seeing that on my server as well
Hello to Edward C.!
Posted by: David | Jan 18, 2007 at 16:53
Now is a great time to be a miner, as numerous high-level characters need low-level metals and gems to powerlevel the new jewelcrafting profession.
Given the way the Prospecting ability works, you may get better results selling metal ore instead of bars.
Posted by: mwl | Jan 18, 2007 at 18:19
>Even the best tier 3 gear is worthless at level 65
This isn't accurate. Many classes are likely to be wearing much of their tier 3 gear (if they have it) into 70.
Posted by: Vykromond | Jan 18, 2007 at 18:43
Two very important but subtle things have happened, one being the lowering of the raid cap from 40 people to 25 people, two being the increased stamina budget on items, (to put it simply, items will have 30% more stamina on them, meaning everyone will have more hit points in general) have changed the game drastically. People have determined a fast-and-loose 'item level' for items that have dropped.
For example, a level 60 green may have an item level of 62. A level 60 blue may have an item level of 54. A level 60 epic may have an item level of 66 coming from an easier dungeon, while anther level 60 epic may have an item level of 80.
From what I understand, the new level 70 encounters, including the initial large raids, are balanced based under the new stamina 'average.' It's said that you will need to be wearing a full set of level 70 blues, (which have an item level of, believe it or not, 115, based on the before-BC standards).
Finally my point: To address the people upset that they've trivialized the previous instances, and made the loot immediately obsolete, the Tier 3 armor sets (previously the hardest armor to collect, before the expansion) is item level 88.
They have trivialized the loot, but I guarantee the people who have jumped through the ridiculous hoops to kill the bosses that drop those Tier 3 armor set piece requirements will be leaps-and-bounds prepared for the level 70 endgame encounters. "Real" experience, not numbers on a character sheet, is something you can't quantify but something that I think matters here.
Posted by: Thomas Mannino | Jan 18, 2007 at 19:31
edit above: A level 60 blue may have an item level of 64.
Posted by: Thomas Mannino | Jan 18, 2007 at 19:32
RedWolf wrote:
"Personally I have been upset by the way the expansion completely negates all previous player achievements over the last 2 years."
Hello treadmill! You need to get better gear so that you can get better gear.
Posted by: lewy | Jan 19, 2007 at 00:03
It so amazes me how such brilliant minds can bow down to expansion packs of MMORPGs. Timothy, I love how you referred to BC as a new *paradigm*. *chuckles*
(All in good jest, eh?)
Posted by: Hiro Pendragon | Jan 19, 2007 at 01:48
RedWolf wrote:
"Personally I have been upset by the way the expansion completely negates all previous player achievements over the last 2 years."
Well, it makes sense if you consider how worthless the gear from lower level instances such as Maraudon or even Scarlet Monestary are at level 60. The difference is that instead of spending a week at those levels, everyone's been spending 2 years at level 60. Really reminds one that it's simply a game, doesn't it?
Posted by: Verilazic | Jan 19, 2007 at 01:54
The current 58-60 dungeons might see use for farming cash down the line, much like Scarlet Monestary was at 60. I think all the raids will see *some* use, but most will skip the lower ones now. My guild is planning on doing MC again tonight (and I'm looking forward to it, having dinged 62 yesterday)- we'll see if we have the attendance we need. But we're fairly casual, we're not a true 'raiding' guild. The mid-week 20man raid was, indeed, cancelled, as it was figured that everyone would be busy in Outlands.
Posted by: Indy | Jan 19, 2007 at 08:35
The only thing I'm upset about is there's no one to run through Zul'Farrak with me - everyone is either leveling their blood elves or in outlands :( Hollow world syndrome until their BC alts reach my level.
Posted by: Gabriel | Jan 19, 2007 at 09:43
The thing I see, is a shift in grouping/guilding, a kind of remixing people/chars on the server. Raidguilds played together for 1 year or more and they consisted of let's say about 60 Memebers. These people met let's say 3 or 4 times a week to raid BWL/AQ40/Naxx. If the time-budget of these players was nearly the same in the days of guild-founding, for some their might have been some changes in the meantime. I speak of people whose raidtimes became their only online-times within the week, as they have more real life, a family, a job...
Others still or again have much time and are usually online everyday and farming, making special quests, pvp, whatever.
Now the people who have only 3 or 4 online-days a week will level up much slower than their former raid-collegues with more time...
From a sociological perspective this change is interesting. Will the fast-levelling guildmates help the slower ones or are there going to be new alliances?
Some Guilds/Raids also planned their actions in Burning Crusade up to the point when all members are level 70 but what happens when there are 30 lvl 70s and 30 lvl 64s after let's say 2 weeks? Will the 70s "wait" with the new dungeons? Is it possible vor the slower levellers to become integrated at a later point of the game again?
Posted by: tom | Jan 19, 2007 at 11:13
RedWolf wrote:
"as it makes players feel like their accomplishments in the game to date have been worthless"
Ahhh, the dawn of realization. Since when were hours spent playing a game anything other than worthless? Are you 'owed' continued 'imagined value' by Blizzard? No. You gave them cash, they gave you addictive entertainment. They owe you nothing.
Now, one could argue that there is actual 'value' involved when real-world economics and RMT are allowed to be considered. In that case, the only de-valuing results from changing worth in stocked goods (the varied 'going rates' for things discussed above) and changing ability for your fixed infrastructure (characters/equipment) to gather/manufacture things for sale. Otherwise changing the economy and price relationships of goods cannot devalue past performance in the economy, merely change strategy for maximizing revenue in the new economy.
Let none forget that apart from actual money earning endeavors (which are usually frowned upon), you are inherently spending your time in a completly worthless fashion. If you consider the 'relationship' aspect of the social network to be of value, then I would contend that while that adds some value back into the mix, it is in an extremely inefficient fashion relative to time spent. (i.e., all that gaming and dealing with game mechanics gets in the way.)
It is a game. Blizzard is responding to the demand to add more play variation for maxed characters. They want to maintain 'fun' for the players who've proven themselves as reliable cashcows. This is purely for additional profit. They owe you nothing, and wouldn't hesitate to drop you, and eliminate all of your 'accomplishments' at the drop of a hat if the total picture showed more profit to be made by doing so. Don't forget that. You're paying for fun. Not status.
Posted by: JiK | Jan 19, 2007 at 13:11
I believe ZG and MC are perfectly fine instances that Blizzard will patch at some future date to also have a Difficulty setting for high level characters.
We shall see.
The Expansion has been out Less Than A Week and already players are Level 70. A lot of my guild is 65+.
Therefore people will soon go back to having free time to farm. Therefore prices on all goods will stabalize along whatever lines they are going to stabalize on fairly soon.
Posted by: Foxfingers | Jan 19, 2007 at 13:20
Within the extremely tight, claustrophobic frame of World of Warcraft, BC is a new paradigm. Keep in mind that is like saying that "Friends" reformulated the sitcom: it's a relative measure. When you step out even one remove to compare WoW with DIKU-Mud style MMOG virtual worlds, BC is old news.
In fact, of course, even in WoW, it's a new paradigm by way of reversion to the old paradigm. Levelling in BC is like being a newbie all over again: easy, fun, non-stressful.
Which means, of course, that Blizzard is going to have spent 2 years developing a quick fix of new content for their junkies, who are proceeding to inject in their veins with abandon. (Confession: I'm already halfway to level 63, so this is not an Olympian disdain for mere mortals.) Blizzard didn't really rethink their entire model for providing new experiences or pleasures as a regular part of their service.
So this time, I suspect, when people hit level 70 and Blizzard tries to find enough drudgery to preoccupy them (I'm estimating in a month or two), they may lose their customers a lot faster. I don't think the newly minted level 70s are going to grind out faction and wait for the next ridiculous uber-instance to come out for two more years until the next expansion. This time, I suspect, they'll be off to other pastures if a sufficiently stable, reliable, content-supplied MMOG goes live six months to one year from now.
The earthshattering paradigm shift, obviously, would be someone figuring out how to have a world of this kind that somehow generates novel experiences for players on a sustained basis. Whether that's a production model somewhat along the lines of Asheron's Call's monthly content updates, or a model of emergent effects within a virtual world, I don't know. But that's the better mousetrap, no doubt about it.
Posted by: Timothy Burke | Jan 19, 2007 at 13:41
I dream of the day when players engaging in pvp can have their gear taken by victorious parties ... just seeing a horde of lowbies ganking a 60 griefer, then taking his raid gear would make me smile :) Course you might lose some subscriptions ...
Posted by: Gabriel | Jan 19, 2007 at 14:39
Just a couple of thoughts:
1) Earning quick cash in Outland makes the inherent struggle to make that gold in Azeroth semi-obsolete. Whether this will lead to rampant inflation of relevant sub-58 BoE gear in the AH remains to be seen. I think the answer is probably yes. There may also be some implications for RMT as a result i.e. I can make 100g in Outland with relative ease while doing something relatively enjoyable, hence my new Blood Elf will not need any other subsidization than that which I can supply in game. On the other hand, if worthwhile goods are massively over inflated in the AH, then the loop is closed and buying gold looks like a good solution again (not that I've ever engaged in that sort of thing).
2) Because the only new lowbie content is lvl. 1 -20, that leaves the long 21 to 50+ grind of Azeroth in place. Personally I've found roughly 24-40 to be the most frustrating part of the game. Partially this is due to the fact that during this segment you have some long distances to travel and no mount. Partially this is due to the fact that I play on PvP servers and 21-40 is relatively ganking intensive, especially problematic if you're on late enough for the guild to have mostly gone to bed.
I suppose the question I'm going for here is whether Blizzard is likely to spend time ironing out creases in the fabric of Azeroth at this point, which is in effect the same issue that applies to old end-game content, or are they pushing full speed ahead? If so to where? If, as Timothy indicates, large numbers of WoW addicts will have used up the extra rush from BC within a few months, then some sort of true paradigm shift (a game that gives us whatever we can't get out of WoW) is inevitable, but where will it come from, when will it arrive, and does Blizz even have these issues on their radar? If nothing truly new and enthralling emerges in the coming year, what does everyone wind up doing in the mean time?
Posted by: Moses | Jan 19, 2007 at 15:55
Aside from the relative value/worth/benefits associated with gear from these "older" instances, I find myself wondering if there's any room for them to serve as some kind of "old school" mark of play, not so much for the 68s and so on who come back for fun, but as a mark of "real" or "hardcore" gamers who took the time to do them, rather than succumbing to the rewards of the Outlands as soon as possible at 58.
Of course, there's no real way to tell if people run those instances (or go back to them) for fun, nostalgia, the gear, or to earn a relatively quick buck (barring the development of in-game vendor-sold t-shirts, I suppose..."I ran MC - ask me how!"), but it will be interesting to see how those end-game zones play out when they're only end-game for those who didn't pick up the expansion, and who's doing what for what reasons.
Posted by: Jenn Martin | Jan 19, 2007 at 15:58
If they didn't make current high-end gear obsolete with the 61+ stuff, they'd make the expansion inaccessible to the vast majority of level 60s that don't have high-end gear. So they had no choice.
Also, it's not just about hitting level 70. They made sure that you have to have very high faction to do the new instances in "Heroic" mode (i.e. upgunned for level 70s). The new ultimate super high-end instance requires very high faction with pretty much every new faction in the expansion. That will all take just a wee bit longer than rocketing to 70.
Not that it will last the 1-2 years before another expansion, but it is some more treadmill.
Posted by: Brent Michael Krupp | Jan 19, 2007 at 16:05
I've noticed the nearly total lack of PvP on my PvP server, at least in the first couple zones. It's as if everyone is running around too slack-jawed at the new goodies to think much of starting any trouble. Contrast that with time in STV and it's remarkable. I can't quite put my finger on why, or if at some point it will revert to KOS form.
Posted by: Dmitri Williams | Jan 19, 2007 at 17:03
@Dmitri
If you play ally I might find it in my heart to do a drive by gank on you if you like, you know just so you dont get board :)
Other Observations:
Obviously prices shot up on very common materials (copper ore) related to jewelcrafting, FA (for people starting new races/classes.) materials (linen cloth, wool etc)
As to people on PVP servers not PVP'ing when in close proximity:
Similar situations have occured in the past, its mostly r/t social constraints and to avoid MAD (mutually assured destruction) once that social constraint breaks down it gets ugly.
As in any arms race both sides are trying to achieve maximum advantage in the shortest amount of time possible and are willing to ignore the enemy while standing right next to them. This is easier to accomplish on a PVE/RP server.
This is why no one in the initial starting areas the first 2-3 days was using AE spells to power grind in a group and mostly still arent.
Interrupting your leveling to start/participate in a war impedes progress to max level.
If this sounds far fetched, go into the starter area near the Road where the first few quests are and start ganking people and see how many nasty tells you start getting from people in your own faction who want to avoid conflict and grind their quests without conflict.
Also I'm putting in some metrics for our beta testers who play WOW, I'd like to see:
1. How many WOW players got the expansion
2. How many hours they've played it at the 7 day mark
3. Did the expansion being released on a week day contribute to absenteeism in the workplace.
So far from early conversations going on in the forums it looks like #3 should be fairly high as a % of the testers.
Posted by: Allen Sligar | Jan 19, 2007 at 19:35
Timothy, thanks for starting up this post.
I think that the junkies filling their veins with abandon could very well be the healthy ones. The people who love the leveling gameplay - but hate the raiding gameplay -- they're probably treating this like a Harry Potter book. You buy it at midnight and call in sick for a few days because you're reading it all day and night. Some of the people racing to 70 are doing it for shits and giggles.
Most are still locked into the raiding mindset. Sure, sure, 25 person caps are going to make it logistically easier for goal-oriented gear grinders to stay happy, keep less demanding schedules, and hit their quotas. Still, a majority of the people racing to 70 (and there already) are part of established raiding guilds who are looking to see if the new endgame is drudgery lite (tm), or if it's the same old pattern.
Personally, I think that Blizzard had something with the PvP endgame that it introduced just before the xpac. You had another route to amazing gear, and instead of wade through countless weeks of 40 person agony, you could get the same gear with significantly less effort on a battleground (next to no effort if you condoned AFKing in AV, fascinating in and of itself). Balancing gear deficits and creating battlegroups with easily accessible PvP was more than a goldmine, it was a full on 5 cap. It really gave you a place where you could pit yourself against others in carefully controlled battles. If they can provide that feel to their raid dungeons, then they might just hit the nail on the head.
This is exciting to watch. =P
Posted by: Neils Clark | Jan 20, 2007 at 04:14
I summed up some of the comments here on my "virtual economies" blog and added my own thoughts (see URL). Personally I am a bit frustrated by the extension (which I DON'T own), because it is both a continuation of Blizzards "maximum profit" strategy and a deviation from the strategy of balancing the game. Depsite fighting gold farmers, RMT, cheating and all things allowing players to gain "unfair" advantages by having and spending more money, BC now means that people who pay the 35 Euros for it are better of than those who don't. Blizzard did a great effort to try to balance the game between BCers and non-BCers, but could such an effort ever succeed? And did Blizzard really WANT to retain the balance? Undoublty, BC is an important point in the history of WoW - it might even be the beginning of the end of it...
Posted by: Matthias Orgler | Jan 20, 2007 at 13:23
"My main interest in virtual worlds remains the way in which they serve as an accidental laboratory for studying historical change in societies over time, and in particular, the evolution of emergent, accidental or unpredictable structures and practices."
cough...academispeak...cough...cough
Posted by: plainspeak | Jan 20, 2007 at 13:53
So what would a translation of that into Plain English look like, plainspeak?
Richard
Posted by: Richard Bartle | Jan 21, 2007 at 05:35
I will break it down for you, focusing on the complex verbs such as "way" and "serve"
"My main interest [the thing that concerns him/her most] in virtual worlds [games such as WoW, Second Life, or City of Heroes, some of which you may already be familiar with] remains [continues to concern this person, possibly as a continuation of a previous conversation] the way [the manner or method in which something occurs] in which they serve [function in a particular manner] as an accidental laboratory [a laboratory which is not necessarily designed for a particular purpose, you know like an accident] for studying [providing an in depth, critical analysis using a recognized methodology] historical [you know, like the past and stuff] change [this happens when things that were one way at one time become something different at a latter time] in societies [large collections of people] over time [cf. change], and in particular, the evolution [a system of change over time where things alter slowly as a result of mutation] of emergent [not necessarily planned, but they happen anyway, again, cf. change/evolution], accidental [again, not on purpose, haven't we been here before?] or unpredictable [things you might not have seen coming] structures [objects in the world] and practices [things people do]."
I can see how you got hung up on all that jargon. If people insist on using crazy phrases like "accidental" and words like interest and "societies" (whatever THAT means), it is going to make this site less and less accessible to those who have some sort of chip on their shoulder about the academy.
It is becoming something of an epidemic. I have even seen words like "history" and "studying" show up in once respectable publications like the New York Times/
When will the madness end?
Posted by: academicspeak | Jan 21, 2007 at 12:00
Background: I'm an old MOO/MUSHer. But I started play WoW in early Nov. 2005 on a PVE server. I hit my first level 60 around Feb 2006; my second 60 around May. I walked both through the portal with my core buddies who began the game with me. Two things are different in WoW as a result of TBC. The first is a recognition that: it *is* the content, stupid. The second is: Novelty makes community way, way more interesting and valuable. Let me explain.
You hear a lot about how MMOs and their guilds are social experiences and how crucial that sense of community is. Indeed a lot of us academics are very interested in this topic. But looking at all the guild emo and the kinds of interactions we had arrived at by level 60...well, to quote Peggy Lee, "is that all there is?"
But yesterday, in our first 5-man in the new world we had some serious fun and found real game value in our virtual community for the first time in a long time largely exactly because NO ONE knew what to expect: what kind of mobs, what floor layout, what will pull with what, how many bosses, what will drop, etc etc etc. The fact is, in the old world, even if you were new to it, every group instance/raid had people in it who knew it inside out. Runs had become routines. Do this. Stand here. Which of the two things we know drop here will actually drop?
Yesterday, we had no routine. So we had to talk a lot, but not just banter. We wiped a lot. We studied the combat log on rez. We debated and modified strategies, it was F*U*N. Add to that the new terrain, the eye candy (gotta love all the planets)...the pleasure and value of the community engagement was back. It wasn't just a chat space. It wasn't just a surgical run with joking over vent cause you don't really have to pay attention. Community, the guild buddies, mattered. We knew what to expect of each other; we trusted each other; we could reason and strategize together as a team without a lot of ego issues you find in PUGs. And, most interestingly, we could improv. together when things went wrong, which they did... a lot.
This improv space was made possible by the return of novelty (maybe a nod to Malaby here on contingencies, if I get him). So, imho, bad news for the game devs. It is the content! Even in the new zones it's fun again. Rolling a new alt. toon was a drag before. Oh no, gotta get through the Legend of Stalvan again. LOL. But this is rolling a new toon in a new land, with new quests, new mobs, even new professions. Yeah, sure, understanding the game grammar helps a lot, but the fun is back because of the new content with the old friends. And that's why I play, and why I play with friends.
Posted by: Linda Polin | Jan 21, 2007 at 22:09
That's indeed completely in line with what I've said, Linda, but I'm sure I've never said it with such engaging effectiveness. You may recall this post from October last -- we talked about the same dynamics, but in ignorance of what the expansion would bring. I've found the same thing in my guild. Lots of social energy generated by the collective engagement of the unknown.
Posted by: Thomas Malaby | Jan 21, 2007 at 23:24
"I dream of the day when players engaging in pvp can have their gear taken by victorious parties ... just seeing a horde of lowbies ganking a 60 griefer, then taking his raid gear would make me smile :) Course you might lose some subscriptions ..."
Posted by: Ace Albion | Jan 22, 2007 at 05:28
Grr. link got buried into the time stamp. What's that all about?
http://www.alwaysblack.com/?p=231
!
Posted by: Ace Albion | Jan 22, 2007 at 05:29
I went back to your Oct. posting, and of course, you said it brilliantly here, though I do like my notion of improv, particularly jazz improv.
Then I got to thinking about what has happened to BGs, you know, the whole arena thing. That may be an effort to trade on that very compelling bond. It's pretty clear that the 2, 3, and 5 man arenas are meant for pre-mades, but because they're PVP, it's always contingencies to some extent. Then again, from playing twinkball in WSG as a lvl 19 twink (yeah, that's right and proud of it), I think the terrain and the game rules are so fixed that routines emerge. We know they're routines because they have been named: turtling, for instance.
So mere PVP / human element isn't enough to generate sufficient contingencies to hold us. (Well, for me at least it got a bit boring). The content (terrain and rules, in this case) has to be somewhat unpredictable. Wouldn't it be possible to make a multivariate instance template where some key elements, especially interactive ones, could be drawn randomly from a set, e.g., a set of mobs, of terrain, of spell schools, of bosses. What if your group went into an instance and found that this time the mobs were casters, tossing frost not fire spells, that the hallways and stairs had changed, that the bosses had moved. That would go a ways toward fighting the issue of buffs and pots and their effect on play. Exotic buffs and pots work when you know what you're going to fight, and how. So much for demonslaying elixir, no demons in here today. Bwahahahahahaha.
Posted by: Linda Polin | Jan 23, 2007 at 01:25
Not surprisingly, what you're suggesting (which would be awesome) reminds me of Tim's wonderful wish for the new year.
Posted by: Thomas Malaby | Jan 24, 2007 at 00:15
@Linda:
Wait for further developments related to The Cavern of Time and the Outlands. We'll likely to see more Diablo-esque features.
There are issues over testing and exploits over the level of dynamics in the design and a desire for a more controlled gaming environment and experience, but I do see hope for more dynamic and contingent designs.
Frank
Posted by: magicback (Frank) | Jan 24, 2007 at 01:39
To add a little sociological "meat" to the thin bones of this TN discussion...
Is there any existing research about how excitement of new content leads to more socially cohesive behaviour in game?
I've noticed a marked improvement in the conduct of players now that Burning Crusade has been released. I'm of the belief that this is down to 2 major factors:
a) Everyone's a noob! It's difficult to be elitest and it's easier to hide incompetence when few people are familiar with content and existing skillsets are of limited use (rapidly evolving itemisation and a changing baselins of avatar puissance).
b) The elusive "fun" factor. People's mood is of course the main component dictating their behaviour towards others. Currently, rather than spending hours grinding drops in oft repeated instances or zones, they're experiencing the "adventure" they were drawn into the game for.
In the long term I also think that the reduction in time taken to complete instanced content will result in less mistakes, less frayed tempers and thus, less friction in instance groups.
Posted by: Gareth Eckley | Jan 24, 2007 at 10:11
Addendum:
Regarding people's comments about meaningful PvP, player driven content, ability to effect permanent change in the game world, dynamic lore generated by players and content that isn't trivialised by expansions, I have 2 words:
Eve Online
The ONLY thing Eve lacks that Warcraft has is accessibility and triviality.
The only reason why I'm not playing EVE is because you can't pay for your account by Paypal anymore and I'm too much of an RL loser to have a credit card.
EVE's playerbase > Warcraft
in terms of maturity, intellect and investment.
Posted by: Gareth Eckley | Jan 24, 2007 at 10:18
Errata
The word is addictive. Regardless of the point you are trying to make, if you use the language of Dubya, you look like a moron.
Posted by: Gareth Eckley | Jan 24, 2007 at 10:25
All i have to say is i really like TBC it's a great new experience and i'm really excited about it finally being here. i've only made it to level 64 but i'm a warrior and i used to generally raid with DPS gear in mind but i have picked up most of my T1 just from it getting auto'd to me. I find myself tanking more and more. the tank has actually become important again in the 5 mans. back in the original game i remember going on the live strat farming runs, with like me in full dps, some dps casters and a good healing spec'd healer we'd spend hours farming the place over and over. you cannot really get people doing stuff they aren't suppose to in these new instances. to me instances seem to be a large focus of the expansion which leads me to believe that the up and coming end game content is going to be alot more complex then anyone could have ever imagined. which makes me pretty happy to find out. I love the complex fights thats the best part, i really hate when you do a boss fights thats pretty much just straight forward tank, heal, dps...gets old after awhile. how AQ40 and NAXX changed all that with the complex fights and everyone has a job that they have to do. i can't wait to see what the level 70 cap brings to this game, i'm excited to get into a good raiding guild and start working on new content
Posted by: Mike M | Jan 24, 2007 at 13:53
Gareth:
"I've noticed a marked improvement in the conduct of players now that Burning Crusade has been released."
One mans marked improvement is anothers carebear enviornment.
I admit I dont like griefers, but well, actually I do like PVP, even world PVP.
Anyhow to answer your question I also added the following this week:
Metrics associated with:
Frequency of engagment with instances (by type)
Experiance with PVP (decline/increase)
Anyone else have some they want to suggest? I'll be monitoring this thread and add them
Posted by: Allen Sligar | Jan 24, 2007 at 16:29
I regulary read this blog - i just like to add my expierince with BC i had untill now.
The first impression i had in BC was the Hellfire Citadell as our realtive full realm didnt run stable - we decided to do instances because the instance server was a bit more reliable.
Hellfire Citadell was pretty easy to do and we completed in in the firs run. We thought that it was in fact to easy to do.
Auchidom instances gets already a bit more challenging - but with a good group perfectly doable.
The problem was that i tryed to do the instance late in the evening with a PUG - there rises a problem - with PUG's and not every one on Vent /TS this instances are very hard / unbeatable. You need to have a very good communication ingame to solve the fights and react accordingly. I.e. the 5 mann instances need you to have you moving constantly starting with Terrokar Instances.
I belive real casual players who are not willing to be on a Ventrilo /TS server or who will not like to invest the time to farm reputation will quit BC very soon.
Lvl 70 Instances are quite challenging for what we tryed out - i am keen on the "hard" mode of the instances which will hopefully provide another challenge to beat. The access to raids will be sort of more limited because you have to complete many of the instances on the hard mode which are already challenging on "normal".
I would agree that Warriors are quite more important in BC than before - we had a Rouge tanking Strath in T2 - this is not possible in BC. Good Warriors are also favord at the moment because you need a real good Tank for most of the instances which require a good amount of reflexes / communication / aggro management.
I would say communication and willingness to adapt new strategies are key to BC. I say BC is a great addon and good fun.
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