« See Jose hit | Main | Dances with Turing »

Apr 29, 2005

Comments

1.

As far a rules or "laws" go I think players will only follow what rules they are forced to follow. If developers want to enforce rules or laws in their VWs then it needs to be in the design. If players find a loophole or bug in the code most players will exploit it.

I think some server communities enforce their own sort of vigilante justice. If a player "ninja loots" an item from your guild or breaks any other unwritten rule they could easily be blacklisted by dozens of players and many guilds. It is like breaking a rule of a social code. Players can not directly punish you but they can choose to ignore you.

2.

On a scale of 1 to 10, my level of agreement with Grimmelman's thesis is 10. As for the idea of mogs as a separate jurisdiction worthy of respect from courts, the agreement level is 11. Today is a good day.

I may have to re-do my talk. "Yahoo avatars are totally awesome!!" is a popular theme here at TN, but it just doesn't seem weighty enough for this conference now.

3.

Nicely done paper. One thing that isn’t mentioned though is the significance of the ease of entry into online worlds. The paper focuses on the effects of two competing groups in the world. But for the Designer, there is a third party contesting for the attention, the non-Players. A rule change may annoy both in world groups, but bring in so many new players that the Designer does it anyway. These are sometimes the most hotly contested rule changes. The current Natives, versus the Immigrants. Always an explosive political mixture.

4.

Just a quick note to say that Ted Wesp has some thoughts up on Ted Castronova's paper at printculture.com -- and a /wave to everyone I'm missing at the conference.

As for a response to Seth, I want to say, yes, the rules ARE in fact in the design. Though many of them are physical and therefore aren't experienced as rules at all (you can't jump 1,000 feet into the air in EQ; you take damage from falling, etc), others are "legalistic" and therefore get noticed, others are community-enforced (no ninja looting), and yet others (probably the ones I'm most interested) are structural and have to do with the way that the game incentivizes (sorry for using that word) certain forms of political, social, or narrative experience.

5.


Some rules will be implementable in code, but some won't be. For instance, you can't just write code to decide when someone has been too much of an asshole, and should be banned. You can't write code to determine a disputed agreement between two parties in the game.

These things have to be determined by some sort of legal norms, and the amazing thing about mogs is that the boundaries between what should be decided by user contract provisions, real-world law, and in-game law, are hard to discern. I think we will need to develop some common understanding on which of these should be used when.

For instance, I could see a system of arbitration developing, wherein a third-party arbitration organization specializing in online law for various types of games becomes respected enough that gamers and game developers both demand their contracts to contain provisions requiring arbitration through this organization's rules. In this way, you could develop a system whereby the arbitration organization would in effect by the trial court of first instance for online worlds...

6.

I agree with whomever says that people will only follow rules if they are forced to follow them. I got bitched at by a level 60 in Stormreaver (my character Popuri) because she thought I knew that I should let her have a chest. I killed one or two monsters to get to the chest, and she got all indignant on me because she thinks I "ninja"ed her on purpose. EXCUSE ME! I do not think she should have bitched at me for something I did not intentionally mean to do. I do not like people who think that just because you have a level 34 mage they assume you have a level 60 character as your main. Well, I had to find this site through Google, and I suggest you get something sent to the official WoW website because you all know that new players have to go there to create their accounts. Accidents and shit happen with no control over it. DO NOT ASSUME everyone knows about the unwritten codes! If you do not want to be "ninja looted" take it up with the WoW board and sort it out that way, then I could get back to having fun playing this game. Unwritten codes are a bunch of bologna unless you have already heard them. I only thought that "ninja looting" was in a group, but I guess you have to show respect to everyone even if you are not in a group. I hate people who flame in whisper chat because they think you know that they wanted something from a chest, herb, or mine or whatnot. As before, DO NOT ASSUME ANYTHING about people you do not know. I get pissed off if someone tries to tell me I am wrong and they try to black ball me for a stupid mistake. It is not like I do not know not to take things when I am in a group. NO ONE EVER TELLS ME ANYTHING *CRYING MY EYES OUT*. There is no reason why I cannot try and make amends for making a harmless mistake. I did not hurt anyone. Whoever says they are hurt by someone taking something on a game, they need a serious dose of real world action by going to Chicago or New York City to know that there are worse things that could happen than someone who takes your chest on a game. It is not like you got raped or something. Why do people make such a big deal out of it? Like I said, you have to bring up your complaints about "ninja looting" with the WoW board and quit bitching about it in the forums or blogs. THANK YOU!

7.

branlette espagnole
vagin
chate
penetration
fille
branlette minute
branlette entre
video branlette
bonne branlette
branlette gratuite

8.

windows messenger sip
messenger windows 2000
messenger cam
messenger 7 hotmail
microsoft messenger 5
net messenger
messenger 7 plus
sms yahoo messenger
google instant messenger
messenger net
windows web messenger
comment supprimer windows messenger
aol instan messenger
webcam yahoo messenger 7
delete windows messenger
windows messenger 10
microsoft messenger version
yahoo messenger 7 patch
yahoo messenger aol
telecharger yahoo messenger 6
windows messenger beta
signed into aol r instant messenger tm
mcn
messenger blocker
mobile messenger

The comments to this entry are closed.